Date: Sat, 2 Jul 2016 14:37:31 +0000
Reply-To: Jim Felder <jim.felder@GMAIL.COM>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: Jim Felder <jim.felder@GMAIL.COM>
Subject: Re: Air conditioning
In-Reply-To: <CA+az7_6rduyOYQVU+QQE+dfWrSgwrTzyTQ9APX4jPy1hq1_OfQ@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
They will make you a better mechanic, that's for sure.
The longer you keep 'em the better you get, even if it's just in the
diagnostic department and you never turn a wrench.
Jim
On Sat, Jul 2, 2016 at 9:26 AM John Rodgers <jrodgers113@gmail.com> wrote:
> But we are all kind of nuts and love our Vanagons!!
>
> John
> On Jul 2, 2016 08:38, "Dennis Haynes" <d23haynes57@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > I definitely agree with Larry. One thing you will find as a new Vanagon
> > owner is that most regular shops are not equipped or willing to bother
> with
> > vehicles of this vintage, never mind the Vanagon with its idiosyncrasies.
> >
> > The air conditioning is American based but its installation layout makes
> > for some servicing difficulties. The evaporators never go bad, the only
> > thing that happens to them is they get clogged with dirt or the foam
> > filter-water stopper disintegrates. There is an expansion valve that
> > sometimes fails and there is a replacement for R-134a conversions.
> > Servicing the evaporator or expansive valve is a labor intensive
> operation.
> >
> > A first waring sign that you tech was not up to the job is if he knew
> > where the high side service fitting is. So did he remove the shelf and
> > corner piece in the rear cabinet to get to it? Not only is it important
> for
> > the high side pressure to be checked as part of normal AC operation you
> > need to make sure the radiator/condenser cooling fan goes into the higher
> > speed mode as pressure increases ~200 psi. There is a lot of electrical
> > involvement with this system.
> >
> > As for charging the system I have really found that the initial charge
> > especially R134a has to done by weight. I also find that topping the
> system
> > off or using the stuff in cans just doesn’t provide full performance.
> When
> > these come on for service I begin by a full recovery. This also tells me
> > how much was left. Was this a slow leak of do we have a problem. Now that
> > refrigerant in bulk is cheap I then do a full charge, 1,400 to 1,500
> grams
> > seems to give really good results. Yes this is a bit over charged but all
> > that hose length takes it. Much more and things will go wacky.
> >
> > At best the performance of the Westy AC is bit lacking. You get that nice
> > cold draft on the back of the head and neck while the sun in your face
> > keeps it sweating but properly working it provide great relief.
> >
> > And yes,
> > VW- turning drivers into mechanics for over 50 years. You will soon be
> > joining our club unless you have an awful lot of money.
> > As for this being low cost way to travel I have some guidelines.
> > If you couldn’t afford it new, you probably can’t afford it used either
> > unless you get creative, skilled, and somewhat lucky.
> > These vehicles were expensive back when they were available and they
> > didn’t sell well back then. Fun Bus was on the dealers lot for almost 6
> > months before I took it home.
> > It was for sale because some previous owner no longer wanted it. It is
> > best if you can figure out why.
> > Whatever you paid it most likely was just a down payment. If you paid a
> > lot your expectations are high and it will take more to meet or maintain
> > those expectations.
> >
> > Dennis
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com] On Behalf
> > Of Larry Alofs
> > Sent: Saturday, July 2, 2016 8:13 AM
> > To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
> > Subject: Re: Air conditioning
> >
> > You should get a second and third opinion about that evaporator
> > replacement. There are many other and more likely causes for poor AC
> > performance, low refrigerant charge being the most likely.
> >
> > With a recirculating system, if the air it's taking in is very hot, the
> > air coming out is not going to be very cold at first. I generally feel
> > that my AC is working pretty well if it reduces the temp by 30F or so.
> > This means that if the van has been standing in the sun and the air in
> back
> > is 110F, the air coming out of the AC might be 80F at first. After a few
> > minutes of circulation, it starts to feel more like actual AC.
> >
> > Do you know if the system still has R-12 in it or if it has been
> converted
> > to 134a or something else? Did this tech actually measure the low and
> high
> > side pressures with the system running? It's complicated. :-)
> >
> > I think the saying goes something like: "VW, converting owners to
> > mechanics for over 50 years."
> >
> > Larry A.
> >
> >
> > On Sat, Jul 2, 2016 at 3:02 AM, Gordon Mah <gordonmahung@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >
> > > Thank you Larry, Dennis and Stan,
> > >
> > > I'll look for those "Bently" manuals even though I don't have a Bently.
> > > ;). I know it has freon because the tech I took it to told me that he
> > > checked it. Problem was that I was expecting air to come out the
> > > front and side vents too. Yes, they did come out the rear as you guys
> > > said, although not all that cold. Somebody told me that the
> > > "evaporator" probably needs replacing. We'll see. I'm realizing that
> > > Westy owners all seem to be mechanical tinkerers. Does any air ever
> > > come out from the side vents above the sliding door?
> > >
> > > Thanks again.
> > > -g
> > >
> > > Sent from my iPad
> > >
> > > > On Jun 29, 2016, at 5:05 PM, Dennis Haynes <d23haynes57@HOTMAIL.COM>
> > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > So the seller didn't show you how things work. Do you have the
> > > > owner's manual? You may want to get one. As a Westy or vanagon
> > > > newbie you will
> > > want
> > > > to get a Bentley service manual ASAP. Learn as much as possible
> > > > before
> > > tings
> > > > break and get ready to catch up on some overdue maintenance. If the
> > > > van
> > > is
> > > > low mileage it is a good bet it spent part of its life not running.
> > > > As
> > > old
> > > > dormant systems and rubber/plastic parts are put to use you will be
> > > > surprised as the things that will need service within a year.
> > > >
> > > > Freon is a brand name for refrigerants. How do you know the system
> > > > has an adequate charge of refrigerant if you don't know how to turn
> > > > it on? Does
> > > it
> > > > even have AC? For an 87 Westy the AC controls are usually to the
> > > > right of the radio. There is no AC from the dash vents, only the
> > > > vents over the
> > > rear
> > > > seat. It is common for these air conditioners to have both
> > > > electrical and refrigeration/leakage problems. The electrical is
> > > > somewhat complicated especially with the interface to the radiator
> > > > fan. Alldatadiy.com is a
> > > good
> > > > choice to get service information including the wiring diagrams. On
> > > > the Westy most of the AC electrical is inside the rear cabinet. You
> > > > have to remove a shelf and that corner piece for the electrics ad
> > > > high side
> > > service
> > > > fitting.
> > > >
> > > > Dennis
> > > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com] On
> > > > Behalf
> > > Of
> > > > Gordon Mah
> > > > Sent: Wednesday, June 29, 2016 3:08 AM
> > > > To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
> > > > Subject: Air conditioning
> > > >
> > > > Just bought me a 1989 Westy and I can't figure out how to get the
> > > > air conditioning to work. It has freon. I tried all the knobs and
> > > > vent
> > > sliders
> > > > and all I get is either heat or just air from the outside. Does
> > > > anyone
> > > know
> > > > the secret combination of sliders and their positions to make this
> > > > baby
> > > keep
> > > > me cool on such hot days?
> > > >
> > > > Thanks!
> > >
> >
>
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