Date:         Tue, 2 Feb 2010 12:27:31 -0600
Reply-To:     mcneely4@COX.NET
Sender:       Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From:         Dave Mcneely <mcneely4@COX.NET>
Subject:      Re: No Clutch....
Comments: To: greg@pottsfamily.ca
In-Reply-To:  <7e577c06541e893db3c19c18a65dee53.squirrel@ketchup.teksavvy.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8

---- greg@pottsfamily.ca wrote:

thanks, sounds like this is a job I can do myself (with my wife's help).  All I need to do is find the slave cylinder and the bleeder valve.  I assume I bleed it all out, then refill the reservoir, pumping until I get fluid out the valve again.  Anything else to it?  Thanks, David Mc

> Hi Dave,
>
> Without asking your mechanic it would be impossible to know for sure if
> the clutch was bled at the same time as the brakes were. Chances are that
> unless that mechanic works on vanagons often, he probably did not know
> that they share the same reservoir.
>
> Best thing to do would be to crack the bleeder valve on the slave cylinder
> and have someone press the pedal. If the fluid coming out is clear, then
> you have little to worry about. If it's yellowish, then it should be
> changed. The best part there is that your helper pressing the pedal just
> needs to press another 12-15 times and the old fluid will have been pumped
> out, and the job is done. It's the same procedure as bleeding brakes.
>
> Greg
>
>
> > Thanks.  So, I changed the brake fluid in May.  I'm assuming from what you
> > say that the clutch hydraulic system needs separately changed.  Is that
> > correct?  Nothing in the owner's manual about that, unless I remember
> > incorrectly.  I'll check it.  But regardless of what it says, it sounds
> > like you are saying to change the clutch fluid in addition to the brake
> > fluid.  Or did my mechanic do that as a part of changing the brake fluid?
> > Thanks again, David Mc
> >
> > ---- pdooley <psdooley@VERIZON.NET> wrote:
> >> The reservoir is fail-safe for the brakes as the clutch draws fluid from
> >> a
> >> higher point, i.e. if the clutch circuit completely fails and all the
> >> clutch
> >> fluid drips out on the pavement, the brakes will still have plenty of
> >> fluid
> >> left.
> >> The clutch and brakes are 2 completely separate hydraulic systems.  The
> >> fact
> >> they share a storage tank doesn't mean much.
> >>
> >> The biggest factor regarding longevity is replacing the brake fluid in
> >> both
> >> systems every 2 years.  The fluid constantly absorbs moisture which in
> >> turn
> >> rusts and pits the bores of the cylinders, both clutch and brake.
> >> And a big problem on vehicles that haven't had the fluid changed often
> >> is
> >> this pitting, not necessarily the seals.
> >>
> >>
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com] On Behalf
> >> Of
> >> Dave Mcneely
> >> Sent: Tuesday, February 02, 2010 10:22 AM
> >> To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
> >> Subject: Re: No Clutch....
> >>
> >> Thanks.  I have been told by a couple of mechanics that it does, but
> >> that
> >> probably was regarding brakes.
> >>
> >> BTW, does the fact that brakes and clutch share a reservoir make for
> >> shorter
> >> life for either system than if each had completely separate hydraulics?
> >> Does it mean that if one fails hydraulically, the other will (certainly
> >> would in the case of leakage, since if one loses fluid, the other
> >> automatically has done so)?
> >>
> >> Thanks, Dave Mc
> >>
> >> ---- pdooley <psdooley@VERIZON.NET> wrote:
> >> > The piston is aluminum, not rubber.
> >> > Also I don't think metal contraction due to temp is relevant here.
> >> > The piston has a small rubber seal that I would bet is causing the
> >> problem.
> >> > Rubber gets hard when cold and doesn't seal that great.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > -----Original Message-----
> >> > From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com] On
> >> Behalf Of
> >> > Dave Mcneely
> >> > Sent: Tuesday, February 02, 2010 9:02 AM
> >> > To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
> >> > Subject: Re: No Clutch....
> >> >
> >> > differential contraction of parts can allow fluid bypass more readily,
> >> I
> >> > think.  Though I have heard it suggested that if bypass is a sometime
> >> > problem, cold will make it less likely because the cylinder itself
> >> > contracts, while the piston is rubber and doesn't.  But I guess my
> >> ignorance
> >> > is showing.  David Mc
> >> >
> >> > ---- Dennis Haynes <d23haynes57@HOTMAIL.COM> wrote:
> >> > > Cold weather has a way of making clutch and brake hydraulics
> >> suddenly
> >> > fail.
> >> > > Especially if the fluid is old and has enough moisture in it to make
> >> ice
> >> > > crystals.
> >> > >
> >> > > Dennis
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > -----Original Message-----
> >> > > From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com] On
> >> Behalf
> >> Of
> >> > > Bill Shawley
> >> > > Sent: Monday, February 01, 2010 6:56 PM
> >> > > To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
> >> > > Subject: No Clutch....
> >> > >
> >> > > Ok gurus, went out to show the van some love, (and to measure
> >> something),
> >> > > took the key to start it as well.  Put my foot on the clutch and
> >> straight
> >> > to
> >> > > the floor, no resistance.  It is very cold, dark, and kind of
> >> immobilized
> >> > in
> >> > > some shoveled snow, hardcore diagnostics can wait.  No problems last
> >> time
> >> > I
> >> > > drove it, may 4-6 weeks ago.  Any guesses to trim the
> >> troubleshooting
> >> > curve
> >> > > for me?
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > Ryan
> >> > >
> >> > > _________________________________________________________________
> >> > > Hotmail: Trusted email with Microsoft's powerful SPAM protection.
> >> > > http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/201469226/direct/01/
> >
>
>