Date: Sun, 11 May 2008 10:03:35 -0400
Reply-To: Mike <mbucchino@CHARTER.NET>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: Mike <mbucchino@CHARTER.NET>
Subject: Re: Tires for 91 GL
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I'm running a pair of Michelin Agilis 61's (185R14C) that came with the
van in the front and a new pair of Agilis 81's (185R14C) in the rear. I
bought them from Tire Rack for a very reasonable price. I love the way the
van sounds on the road, handles on the bumps and corners. You get what you
pay for.
When I need to replace the fronts, I'll buy 3 more of the Agilis 81's.
That tire date coding expose' on tv yesterday really drove the point home
about not wanting to buy tires over 6 years old.
The 61's are no longer available, so the 81's are the next closest match.
They have a 'D' rating, so I put them in the rear. These tires do NOT ride
harshly, in fact there's there's no noticeable difference than if they were
C's. I HIGHLY recommend them. They look nice, ride quietly and are also a
selling point, if so inclined.
my 2 cents,
Mike B.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Scott Daniel - Shazam" <scottdaniel@TURBOVANS.COM>
To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2008 10:22 PM
Subject: Re: Tires for 91 GL
You're very right.
The original 205/70's - a *perfect* size on that van , where reinforced. You
might not be able to find anything but "P' car tires in that size.
You do not want P205/70 anything, or any P tire on a vanagon.
That P means 'passenger car.'
Their sidewalls are not stiff enough.
I did however, take the studs out of a ( non P ) set of Hakepalida 205/70 R
14 tires, and it turned the van into a sports car, from a boat.
They are T rated for speed.
Technically they might be a tad 'not quite the right rating' but they work
like a dream
The 185 and 195 - if in C load rating, they are perfect.
I have seen C rated 185 R 14,s that are really D load rated.
D load rating is an extremely stiff sidewall tire.
They are used for trailer tires - as what you want is very low rolling
resistance.
I find them too harsh - but a matched set of 4, in D load rating might work
fine.
I've driven an 86 camper vanagon the 'Jupiters' on it - a popular tire a
while back in that size and rating.
In fact, I have 3 really really good ones that I'll sell.
And 185 or 195 in C load rating - just about perfect.
Yes, I mixed up T speed rating and C & D load rating.
In speed raring, H rated tires are pretty harsh. A performance car tire.
My 88 turbo Volvo uses them in 195/60 R 15.
They can be desperately harsh at lower speed.
Lowering the tire pressure helps some, but tire pressure can only 'sort of'
make up for what a tires rating is.
Putting very high pressure in a non-vanagong rated tire barely helps make it
have stiffer side walls. Same for lower pressure with an H rated tires.
When I run my 185/60 R 15 snow tires in the winter on my turbo volve, even
on pavement, it turns into a delightly tossible car with fantastic and
nimble ride.
I found a set of 195/60 R15's summer/rain M & S tires in T rating. Can't
wait to try those. The H ones won't wear out though, and the rear ones,
which I got off a Saab 9000 in a junkyard with 80 % tread - totally out of
round, well shake the front end to pieces, and it's not balance either.
Right now I thnk the best overall use choces are either 185 R 14 C, C rated,
or the 195 - those a tiny bit bigger and look and work fine.
Or a 205/70 in a non car tire, with good load ratings, max lbs rating, and
max pressure rating.
If you look at the max load rating and max pressure rating on the tires -
you'll find you want about 1,700 lbs max load rating per tire, and the
stronger the tire the higher the max pressure is. You'd like to see 50 psi
or so max pressure rating.
The 185 R14 C's that are really D load rated - their max rated pressure is
65 psi ! real overkill though I think on a vanagon,
But people run matched sets of 4.
You do not ever want D load rated tires on the back and LT's ( light truck,
which is about like a C load rating ) or C load rated tires on the rear.
The van will bounce all over the place on bumps, steer like a barge, and be
just awful. Going down on front tire pressure on helps a little
I've also gotten into 27 by 8.50 R 14 - that's a truck type size system.
That size is going out of favor, but at my local Less Schwab tire place, I
saw a set of four that looked awesome.
They do have the load rating to, a truck thing, like an LT tire.
I have never run them on the front, just the rear- and they are nigh perfect
on the rear for a 2WD vanagon. Nicely a 'bit larger' look knarly, help the
gearing a tiny bit etc.
For sure 14 inch tires are going out of use.
It's all 15's and 16's now, but there are still good 14 inch vanagon rated
tires available.
I like my cars to feel nimble, not truck like.
I'm super pleased with those T speed rated Hakepalida's. Steers like a
sports car, and tracks just fine. I'd buy a summer version of that tire if
there was one, probably.
The 205/70 tire is a great size for all around use - just need to find it
in vanagon -rated.
I have a set of 4 Michelin Rainforce tires that came off a syncro.
Can't say I especially like them, they look small for one thing.
oh - go study at tireack.com
and call them on the phone too, their phone people are sharp that I've
experienced though they might not be very vanagon savvy.
But you can read reviews, get outside diameter, a hundred things.
You spend hours on their site, it's really good.
Like a library/encyclopedia of tires. ( the original size tire that's not
205/70 or 185 R 14 C, is the 195/75 R 14 LT. always a great all around
vanagon tire.
I think I'd start there with LT tires and see what I found.
LT as a tire type is dead perfect on a vanagon , sufficient, but not too
stiff.
And if you find 205/70's in a proper rating - perfect.
I've noticed that the D load rated, and the C load rated tires to a lesser
extent, have very plan tread patterns.
I think to achieve the load rating, and tread life, they have to make the
tread pattern very plane.
Look at the front tires on all big trucks - just a very plane tread, not any
little blocks or sips or anything.
I'd not want that on a vanagon myself, personally. LT's have great tread
patterns though, and the others, and perfect sidewall stiffness.
If you had to pick just 'one tire' .........the traditional Wildcat 195/75 R
14 is your 'do anything' tire. They've stopped making Wildcats though
believe.
Not as wide as a 205/70, but quite nice. No complaints at all - whether dry,
rain, snow, etc.
Anyone want to buy 3 at least 60 % tread life remaining vanagon D load rated
Jupiter tires ?
The 'Jupiter' is a nice looking tire too. I just don't think they make them
anymore, but I'm just guessing too, haven't really tried to track one down.
I really don't want D load rating - bit too stiff.
I have about 20 sets of mounted vanagon tires and 6 vanagons to play with
too, so I get to test out various setups.
I have a 'thing' about tires too, I love them.
They are THE SINGLE most important thing with the biggest affect on how your
vanagon rides, steers, handles etc. The single most important factor
-affects the whole car.
Resist putting on very over sized tires. There's little to gain and lots to
loose.
Change the gearing, if that's why you're going for too tall tires.
Scott
www.turvans.com
-----Original Message-----
From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com] On Behalf Of
Stephen Edwards
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2008 5:36 PM
To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
Subject: Re: Tires for 91 GL
Hi Michael,
Be careful with those 205/70/14's - last time I checked there was no
longer any such tire available that has the correct load range for
the Vanagon. I'm no tire expert, but I do know that the 185R14 and
195R14 such as Bus Depot carries are reinforced tires which is what
the manufacturer originally recommended (I have the 195's and am very
happy with them even though the ride is not quite as sweet as it was
on the discontinued Michelin Rainforce 205's). Don't forget, 14" is
a very small rim to carry all that top heavy load.
Sincerely
Steve, in Chicago with 91 Vanaru GL
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