Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2008 13:07:43 -0800
Reply-To: Scott Daniel - Shazam <scottdaniel@TURBOVANS.COM>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: Scott Daniel - Shazam <scottdaniel@TURBOVANS.COM>
Subject: Re: 1985 Vanagon - Ford Focus Engine alternative
In-Reply-To: <ac1f198b0801111145r10981d8bt700117dbccf59d73@mail.gmail.com>
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Super good Jim.
A win-win all around. Very impressed.
Just one more detail - what did the junkyard engine cost ??
I always try to avoid things like external oil lines. I used to see old
Buses with oil coolers mounted on the side .......swipe one tree or light
pole, and you're dead right there ! very dumb.
I try to make them Al-Can Highway or Baja worthy. Oil is the most critical
fluid of course. External lines not too desirable. They need to be
overbuilt and well protected of course.
Scott
www.turbovans.com
-----Original Message-----
From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com] On Behalf Of
Jim Akiba
Sent: Friday, January 11, 2008 11:46 AM
To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
Subject: Re: 1985 Vanagon - Ford Focus Engine alternative
> > - The farther I go
> > from stock, the more I am my own warranty
How's this for unconventional as well. I don't see too many vendors
sharing as much info as we like to. This is the write up of our first
warranty engine replacement, then ask yourself can peripheral things
like this happen to any conversion? If so what would the outcome be?
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Bostig's first warranty engine replacement.
Unlikely as it sounds, the story of our first experience with a
warranty replacement is an important part of the picture, as it
answered questions that we ourselves wondered.
In theory, all the aspects surrounding our conversion with regard to
service and support sound quite good. The best warranty, inexpensive
engines, easily obtainable inexpensive parts, more places and
mechanics that are willing to work on it etc. Except for one thing.
What actually happens if something goes wrong... say on a road in the
middle of Wyoming?
Well, we now have a very good idea of how it does work, as we've been
through it. Before you get too depressed, the failure of the engine
didn't have anything to do with the engine itself, or with any part of
the standard conversion. It did have to do with a broken oil hose on
an external oil cooler kit.
I got a call one afternoon from our second supercharged conversion
customer Kipp. The question put to me was... "How do I know if the engine
is seized?" I described how to turn the crank with a hand tool to
check, and sure enough it was. The story began to unfold.
Apparently he had been driving along, and noticed the oil light was
on. He pulled over and shut the engine down immediately. On
inspection, the back of the van was covered in oil, and when he
checked the level, there was no reading on the dipstick. After adding
a quart, and still with no reading, he proceeded to add the full
volume of the oil system in order to get a reading. When he went to
start it back up, there was no crank. He found the source of the oil
leak, one of the lines from an external oil cooler kit we had
installed on the two first supercharged vans had broken. Although he
had caught the oil pressure light and pulled over as soon as he saw
it, the leak had been going on for long enough that it had pumped the
entire contents of the oil system out of the broken hose, which is why
the system had to be filled before a reading appeared on the dipstick.
It was also long enough to damage and heat the internals to the point
where as soon as it was turned off, it seized.
Well clearly the company that makes the cooler kit, and goodyear that
made the hose weren't going to be paying for anything. So I stopped
the buck with us, because afterall we installed it. There was only one
conversion running this type of external cooler, this one. We normally
use a coolant/oil heat exchanger from the zetec Ford Escape setup as a
cooler, which avoids bringing oil outside of the block into external
lines, but since this was the second install, it still had the
external oil cooler and remote mount filter setup(it no longer does).
After we quickly determined the engine was seized, our customer had
the van towed to Fremont Ford in Cody. Ok so now this is interesting.
A VW Syncro sitting at a Ford dealership in Wyoming... how would they
react? Would they do the engine replacement? Not only was it a bit
weird, but this is also a supercharged conversion, so the supercharger
components all needed to be swapped over to the replacement as well.
When I spoke with the dealer service manager Scott in trying to find
this out, he told me that their head tech was asked to determine
whether or not they could do the job. Another call later, and the
answer I got, was an emphatic yes... the head tech took one look over
the conversion, and said yes because "it's much easier to do than when
the zetec is in the focus!", which is what we know to be true also,
and were hoping they'd pick up on.
I made one call to a yard 180 miles from the dealer also in Wyoming.
They had an engine with 7k miles on it, and could have it at the
dealer the following Monday as it was already the end of the week.
Without a hitch, the engine was sent to the dealer, and the dealer
techs swapped the supercharger over and installed the replacement.
They also installed the replacement oil cooler setup, but
misunderstood part of the instruction and left the remote oil filter
arrangement(which has since been taken care of as well).
Now under the letter of the warranty, the engine replacement wouldn't
be covered, there is a measure of user interface with regard to the
oil light, and the failure is of a soft part... however in light of
the fact that we both installed the oil cooler kit, and chose it to
begin with, we felt responsible as well. I discussed the labor charges
with our customer, and we decided to go half and half on the labor
charge for install. Normally this might have been a bigger point of
contention, but the labor charges only amounted to $1800. Keep in mind
this is at a dealership too. So we covered the engine, the shipping of
the engine, the updated cooler, and $900 of the $1800 to return the
van to running condition, with a fresh 7k mile zetec back in it.
Lesson learned with regards to the oil cooler, and actually the whole
recovery ordeal went like clockwork... someone was found to do the
work on the first try, for a good price. We found a local, low mileage
engine, that doesn't need reworking, re-gasketing, or re-sealing
before install, to be swapped right in. Perhaps most importantly, our
customer found that we do what we say we will do, and much further
beyond to ensure he is well taken care of.
Jim
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From Kipp, the customer:
I was on a road trip with 3 madmen. They are fishing guides and had
just completed the 2007 season. They needed to dump some stress from
6 months of dealing with the public. They're based on the Madison
River in Montana so we decided to see some new water and travel to
the Wind River in Wyo. and go fishing and just generally raise hell.
The trip went as planned and we were heading back to our home waters
on a fine fall morning in the Rocky Mountains, listening to some good
music and telling some fishing lies when the oil light went on. I
pulled over on a deserted highway and walked around to the engine,
unfortunately the posse emerged as well. The smart guy in the crowd
says "Dude where's your oil?" after seeing no oil register on the
dip. We turned around and on the highway spread over 20 yards was my
oil!
I crawled under and saw one of the oil hoses to the remotely mounted
filter flapping in the Wyoming morning breeze.
The posse was now starting to get unruly with a combination of comedy
and ridicule and I realized I needed to get my shit together fast or
face a lifetime of Van jokes from these low lifes.
I contacted Jim in Boston immediately on my cell and he and Brady
quickly assessed the situation and helped me plan out the next move.
The nearest town was Cody, Wy., 60 miles back down the road and they
had a Ford dealer. I arranged a tow and we were in Cody in less than
2 hours. The posse had quieted down after the plan was articulated to
their hung over brains and set in motion.
I left the van in Cody at the Ford dealer and Jim took over from
there. He dealt with the mechanic and dealer directly and I returned
to Montana with the boys.
I was quite amazed by the level of service provided by Jim and Brady.
There was never any question of what was their position and
responsibility. I contacted them by cell or email many times through
this ordeal and I would receive a response the same day and
frequently immediately. I'm a retired interventional cardiologist and
I didn't always receive this level of service even when a patient's
life was on the line.
My baby is back in business and once again kicking butt on the
highway with the Zetec super. I'm the original owner of this 1990
Synchro and had put all the miles on it myself.
Kipp