Date:         Fri, 22 Feb 2002 16:56:30 -0500
Reply-To:     Ben huot <huotx@VIDEOTRON.CA>
Sender:       Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From:         Ben huot <huotx@VIDEOTRON.CA>
Subject:      Re: Cyl head removal advice

This message as been sent to week 3 and i think it should be sent again for
the information of others and the poster in question. These information
contain the procedure for checking the cooling system.

Good day Matthias,
I have many suggestion and comment.
First I will comment part of your post = " your post"

First of all, did you bleed the cooling system properly?
(if you need info on that subject I can send you some.)

"Put in a new thermostat", is it a VW?
You should use OEM!

"I have also replaced the water pump"
how was the old one? Was the outer bearing loose? Another things to look
for:  worn area of block where pump impeller rides (can be repaired with JB
weld)

"The engine is still overheating, and the radiator doesn't get hot."
There is simple no coolant circulation, thermostat can block the
circulation or the pump is not producing enough flow.

"Very low pressure, though it seemed."
Pressure is one thing (describe below) and flow is another thing, the flow
of any engine is very slow /low or small, it is just a liquid circulation.

"I drained the oil (engine cold), and the oil seemed "weird" (hm, I
know-weird), I mean it looked very thin and almost creamy. Would that be
coolant mixed with oil?"
Not good, oil should be oil! If you think that there is coolant inside the
oils system, the following and complete instruction should help.
How is the oil level, is it higher than normal? How is coolant, is there
oil inside?

"Does, when the head gaskets fail, internally, coolant get pumped into the
engine, and there's not enough pressure to get it up to the radiator?"
1)-There is no "get it up to the radiator", it's already full of coolant,
the pump is just doing a movement of coolant control by the thermostat.
2)-Yes but this is not usual, and a failure of the inner ring (gasket) is
normally a slow process accompanied by a white smoke at the exhaust.
If you stop the normal cooling flow because you have a broken inner gasket
you should also have a rising oil level and for sure a big white smoke in
the back of the van?
Also, if your sucking coolant into the combustion chambers you have a risk
of pistons rings seizure (But this is a long process = pistons rings
seizure)

"The compression test I did checked out at 165-175 psi throughout."
Mmmm., not sure about that, but the only possibility is that there is an
abnormal amount of """substance""" in the compression chamber. Probably
coolant.
Did you double check the "head bolt" torque? I know that the torque was
increase on the 1.9 by VW.

"I will go with rebuilding the WBX 1.9 engine. I saw an ad that said
"$975.00, installed" for a 1.9s. This seems awfully little.
Most VW engine rebuild by other company suck!!!!, be careful! $975 doesn't
look right
I think that maybe you just need new head gasket and not a complete engine.
If you can remove the engine yourself, you CAN do the rest of the job
to!!!!! With some little help from a VW dealer to reseal the new heads
gasket. Changing the head gasket is a bit tricky but not the end of the
world at all, the only thing is to make sure that the inner gasket stays is
well align when putting the heads back.

The following is the procedure to check the cooling system pressure, this
is a post I did not so long ago on http://www.westfalia.org.

The problem "could be" that pressure is building up in the cooling system.
This is due to the head gasket (the 2 round one found each side) at the top
of the cylinder leaking compression. Normally this symptom happens when the
engine is cold but if you have a major leak at the inner head gasket this
will happen at any temperature. When I did my heads I had more than 15lb of
pressure in the cooling system. So that means that my inner head and outer
head gasket had failure (I had a leak on the right side). The following are
 a summarization of 2 tests I found a year ago on Boston Bob engine web
site, they are reliable test. Remember that the coolant flow is low even at
high RPM. The more the engine rise in temperature, more the pressure is
high.

TEST #1: Pressure Tests for the Cooling System
The first test of the cooling system is done when the engine is cold.  A
cooling system pressure tester can be installed in place of the radiator
cap. Pressure in the cooling system and hot coolant are not something to be
treated lightly.  Use caution, and never remove the radiator cap from an
engine that has been run even for even a short time. After installing the
gauge, pump it up to 10 pounds. Look around for leaks if the gauge shows
any pressure loss. Common trouble spots include heads, hoses, water pump
and rear heater core. If you smell something sweet when you turn the heater
fans on, it may be a coolant leak at one of the heater cores, or simply the
O-ring at the rear heater valve leaking. Because there is often more then
one leak in the system, it is necessary to continue pressure testing until
the system holds pressure.

TEST #2
Start the engine cold with no pressure indicated on the gauge.  The
pressure in the cooling system builds to aprox 7 lbs at normal running
temps looking around for leaks. But if the pressure builds quickly to
around 15 lbs the pressure is coming from one of the cylinders through the
inner head gasket. This can also show up as a coolant pressure loss in the
first test. In extreme cases the cylinder can fill with coolant, and will
not turn over. This is know as hydraulic lock, and if you suspect this pull
the spark plugs and tries to turn the engine again. Pulling the plugs from
the engine allows water to escape from the spark plug holes.

This is simply a suggestion but the first test is easy to do and will tell
you right away where is your leak or leaks.
I hope I have been of some help, sorry for my poor English but I try my
best.
Ben, Montreal, Canada.