Date:         Wed, 22 Aug 2001 10:00:31 -1000
Reply-To:     Mick Kalber <hotlava@INTERPAC.NET>
Sender:       Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From:         Mick Kalber <hotlava@INTERPAC.NET>
Subject:      Re: Trailer Fishtailing...
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

Walt...

Isn't the proper distribution at least 60% forward, 40% rear or something
like that?

I've done a bit of trailering myself and know the importance of loading the
heavy stuff in the front.

Mick
Hilo, Hawaii


----- Original Message -----
From: Walt Spak <wnsopc3@3RDM.NET>
To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2001 8:03 AM
Subject: Re: Trailer Fishtailing...


> John & list,
>
> What you are calling fish tailing sounds like what I call sway.  It is a
> result of improper load distribution on the trailer.  There was too much
> weight towards the rear, which resulted in too little weight on the tongue
> of the trailer.  I learned this lesson years ago when hauling cars on
> various flat bed trailers.  I even had a van & loaded trailer turn 180
> degrees around on the Ohio Turnpike.  It is interesting to sit in the
middle
> of the road & watch traffic coming at you.  The highway wear & rain
grooves
> affected your tow because of the improper distribution, but were not the
> cause.
>
> I do not remember exactly how much weight you want on the tongue & I
believe
> it changes with the trailer size & weight and the hitch class.  Proper
> tongue weight is very, very, very important.
>
> Walt Spak
> Pittsburgh, PA.
> wnsopc3@3rdm.net
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: John Klun <jklun@GJ.NET>
> To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
> Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2001 1:23 PM
> Subject: Trailer Fishtailing...
>
>
> > Hello Volks-
> >
> > A few days ago, someone sent a posting about their fishtailing problem
> when
> > hauling a trailer.  Here's my two cents worth.  (Alas, not really
Vanagon
> > content but applies...)
> >
> > About 2 weeks ago, I had the 'opportunity' of hauling, from Dallas, TX
to
> > Delta, CO, an 18'X7' trailer (weighs about a ton) loaded with about 2-3
> tons
> > of equipment behind a Ford F-150 X-Cab with a (get this) 302CID engine-
> and
> > an automatic to boot!  Yikes!  We found out later that the trailer
brakes
> > were not working or even installed.  Dumb and Dumber!
> >
> > There was so much weight behind us and so little power, it took forever
to
> > get up to speed.  We also suffered from that 'harmonic' fishtailing that
> was
> > mentioned.  We found it was set off by the difference in wheel widths
> (truck
> > 6', trailer 8') going over rutted highways.  All the way from Dallas to
> > Clines Corners, NM, the highways had grooves in them from heavy trucks
> > driving in the same spots.  We also noticed that the fishtailing was
> caused
> > by too high a speed and trucks passing us at high speed- especially with
> > high cross winds.
> >
> > We didn't seem to have any problems wherever the roads had fairly fresh
> > asphalt laid down- such as I-40 in New Mexico.
> >
> > The scariest moment I had was when we were traveling, balanced steady,
in
> > the grooves at around 65 (speed limit was 75) when we were passed by an
18
> > wheeler doing about 80 and there was a crosswind blowing from the
driver's
> > side.  We immediately started fishtailing so bad that I thought I was
> going
> > to lose it.  Nothing that I did could stop it and only made it worse.  I
> > kept over correcting without trying to.  Finally I resigned myself to
the
> > possibility that it was all over and let up on the wheel.  Lo and
behold!
> > The fishtailing reduced dramatically!  And I was finally able to get it
> > under control.  Yes, I did let up on the gas but not enough to jack
knife
> > and yes, I kept my foot off the brakes for the same reason.  The only
> other
> > thing that I noticed that helped besides taking my hands off the wheel
was
> > steering the truck and trailer half on/half off the shoulder.  That
> steadied
> > the fishtailing some.  Next time- it will be a heavier truck with a more
> > powerful engine.
> >
> > Surprisingly, we didn't have much of a problem on the mountain passes.
> > Obviously, with that heavy a load, we were in 1st gear all the way to
the
> > top at around 10-15 mph.  I kept it in 1st gear on the way down as well
> > never letting our speed get more than 30 mph over our base speed.  I
> braked
> > heavy to get down to the base speed and continued doing that until the
> road
> > leveled off enough to shift into 2nd/3rd.  The brakes were fine coming
> down
> > this way.  There was one 8,000' pass where I got very cocky and didn't
> leave
> > it in 1st long enough coming down (it was steep) before shifting.  We
paid
> > for that by almost losing it and when we finally stopped in a pull off,
> the
> > brakes were glowing red in the dark and the right one was smoking like
it
> > was on fire!  That's when we found out we had no trailer brakes...
(don't
> > ask).  After that episode, the trip was very uneventful.
> >
> > John
>